Thursday, 2009-11-05

../irclogs/#mantishelp.2009-11-05.log
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CIA-22Mantisbt: vboctor * re580d34cf917 /core/file_api.php: Fixes #11117: Unable to get files attached to ALL_PROJECTS - thanks to watergad.04:04
CIA-22Mantisbt: vboctor master-1.2.x * r0b7510c09713 /core/file_api.php: Fixes #11117: Unable to get files attached to ALL_PROJECTS - thanks to watergad.04:04
CIA-22Mantisbt: vboctor * r3af3ab3e1af6 /core/authentication_api.php: Fixes #11125: Auto-focus on password field when re-authenticating address.07:03
CIA-22Mantisbt: vboctor master-1.2.x * rf9de1f5a2d98 /core/authentication_api.php: Fixes #11125: Auto-focus on password field when re-authenticating address.07:04
CIA-22Mantisbt: vboctor * r9d2ebf2fc8e9 /core/filter_api.php: Fixes #11124: The 'sticky_issues' value stored in the mantis_filter_table is not always stored correctly.07:17
CIA-22Mantisbt: vboctor master-1.2.x * r9025cc676b2d /core/filter_api.php: Fixes #11124: The 'sticky_issues' value stored in the mantis_filter_table is not always stored correctly.07:20
CIA-22Mantisbt: hickseydr master-1.2.x * r896c5e52a926 / (41 files in 9 dirs): Merge branch 'master-1.2.x' of mantisbt.org:mantisbt into master-1.2.x07:20
dhx_mdoh07:20
vb123hi07:51
vb123dhx_m: ?07:51
dhx_mvb123: hi :)08:03
vb123hi dhx_m08:06
dhx_mnice to see you on IRC :)08:06
dhx_myour new plugin is quite interesting08:07
vb123I haven't been on it for a while.08:07
vb123glad you liked it.08:07
vb123did you see the refreshed version?08:07
dhx_mI was looking at similar things just a short while ago (Ubiquity from Mozilla, OpenCog, etc)08:07
dhx_myep08:07
dhx_mbtw thanks for fixing the sticky issues bug08:10
dhx_mthat one has been frustrating me for ages heh08:10
vb123no worries about the filtering bug.08:10
vb123I hate filtering though!08:10
vb123this one counts as 2 ;)08:10
dhx_mone of the reasons I didn't fix it myself before :p08:10
vb123relating to MantisCmd08:10
vb123I'm thinking of "f filtername" to activate a saved filter.08:10
vb123rather than specifying the filtering on the command line itself.08:10
vb123this is in addiition to common filters like "mine"08:10
dhx_minstead of implementing filters into the command line...08:10
dhx_msuch as "delete all issues with a priority higher than normal"08:10
dhx_mor "view all issues with a target version of 1.2.0"08:10
vb123I was referring to the latter.08:11
dhx_mthat seems to be what Ubiquity and other similar native language command prompts are heading towards08:11
dhx_mhmm08:11
dhx_mso it'd be a two step process to filter in your case?08:11
dhx_mie.08:11
dhx_mf some-saved-filter08:11
dhx_mv08:11
dhx_m(now you see a list of issues matching the filter)08:11
dhx_md *08:11
dhx_m(now you're asked to confirm that all issues shown should be deleted?)08:12
dhx_metc08:12
vb123correct08:12
vb123that would keep the language simpler08:12
dhx_mI can see how that works, seems quite reasonable to me08:12
dhx_minstead of specifying long complex commands08:12
dhx_myou instead ask people to enter short commands to filter things down08:13
dhx_mmakes sense to me08:13
vb123you can still has filter xxx yyy hhh jjjjj08:13
vb123but filter is separate from deletee08:13
dhx_myep08:13
dhx_mso you start with "all issues" (or a default filter)08:13
dhx_mand then to perform actions on multiple issues08:14
dhx_myou apply filters one by one, updating the list of issues as you go08:14
dhx_muntil you get down to just the issues you're interested in08:14
dhx_mrather than start with all issues and specify all the filter arguments as one long complex line of commands?08:14
vb123scope then execute08:15
vb123yes08:15
dhx_myep08:15
dhx_mthat way you can also save progress as you go08:15
dhx_mand get back to it quickly08:15
vb123commands have simple scopes like: none (like mu to default to current user), mu vboctor (simple scope), mu * (* for issues would be all matching current filter).08:16
vb123mu is a bad example.08:16
dhx_mI understand though08:16
vb123actually "mu *" can redirect you to Manage Users page.08:16
dhx_mit's one command at a time, rather than dealing with piping and logic operations, etc08:16
dhx_mit'd be neat if the commands could be made fairly similar between pages08:17
dhx_mso "mu" to switch to the manage users view08:17
vb123what do you mean?08:17
dhx_mthen you apply filters in the same way you'd apply them to bugs08:17
dhx_mand the shortcut keys to delete/edit users would match that of bugs08:17
dhx_mso:08:17
vb123mu v*08:18
dhx_mmu (switch to manage users mode)08:18
vb123filtering users can work if we support this i nthe first place.08:18
dhx_mf name=david (or some other way to add a filter)08:18
dhx_md (delete all users named david)08:19
dhx_mwhich would be similar to handling bugs in that "f" and "d" commands are the same08:19
dhx_mand one doesn't need to remember that bd = bug delete, ud = user delete, etc08:19
vb123I'm attempting to limit the commands to be shortcuts to features that are already supported.08:19
vb123so all the functionality / access checks are done in the core code.08:20
vb123the cmd processor just redirects to a URL.08:20
dhx_myeah I like that :)08:20
dhx_mbut it always has to redirect to a confirmation page doesn't it?08:20
dhx_motherwise you'd get issues with CSRF tokens08:20
vb123for actions like delete, yes.  Unless we hace some force flag.08:21
vb123url pages have to protect themselves anyway, and hence, CSRF is not a specific issue for MantisCmd.08:22
dhx_myep08:22
dhx_mbut for something like bug_stick.php and bug_unstick.php08:22
dhx_mthose are commands without user confirmation08:22
dhx_myet they still use CSRF08:22
dhx_mso we'd really need bug_stick_page.php and bug_unstick_page.php in the middle to make it work with MantisCmd08:23
vb123you mean the tokens?08:23
dhx_myep08:23
dhx_mMantis should really be forcing CSRF tokens to be used whenever data is sent via POST08:23
vb123we will have to work around this.08:23
vb123so far the cmdline uses only GET08:24
dhx_mand POST should be used whenever we're modifying any data within Mantis08:24
dhx_myep, GET/view is OK08:24
vb123I would rather have a smaller set of actions that apply changes.  For example, pick 123 to self assign.08:25
vb123resolve 12308:25
vb123btw, do you want access to the MantisCmd repo?08:26
dhx_mback sorry08:46
dhx_myeah I'd be interested in adding some commands, it looks quite simple to do08:47
dhx_mI guess it is a case of conventions for command naming, etc08:47
dhx_mone suggestion is to create an array of commands with multiple columns08:49
dhx_mie.08:49
dhx_mhmmm scrap that ;)08:50
vb123dhx_m: I've added you to MantisCmd.09:31
dhx_mcool, I'll see what I can do :)09:33
dhx_mI'm a little busy until the later part of November though09:34
dhx_mwhich is why I haven't committed much lately09:34
vb123no worries!'09:38
dhx_mit's been good to see quite a lot of commits lately09:39
dhx_m1.2.0 final is looking like it'll be quite solid09:39
dhx_mit's getting a lot of testing09:39
vb123yep, I actually think we should think of 1.2.0 final or at least rc3 very soon.09:40
vb123The bug that is blocking in my mind is that if you logout, then use a link like http://www.mantisbt.org/bugs/view.php?id=11111 ---you will be asked to login even though our bug tracker supports anonymous login.09:41
dhx_mwasn't that fixed recently? I can't remember for sure though09:42
vb123I got the impression from John that it is fixed.  However, it still doesn't work on our live instance.09:43
vb123nuclear_eclipse: what's up with the above issue?09:43
dhx_mhmm yeah it still is a problem I see09:47
dhx_m11088 is also highly user visible09:47
dhx_mbug 1108809:47
* nuclear_eclipse wishes Victor didn't wait until 4AM to get online...13:43
dhx_m:)13:45
CIA-22Mantisbt: jreese master-1.2.x * r2aac6b773a75 /core/plugin_api.php: Fix #11090: NOTICE when soft dependencies not met14:17
CIA-22Mantisbt: jreese * rb0b8cd4b5b03 /core/plugin_api.php: Fix #11090: NOTICE when soft dependencies not met14:17
paulr_moo20:07
paulr_john?20:07
vb123nuclear_eclipse: are you there?20:12
vb123I've reported several issues again product matrix php notices.20:12
nuclear_eclipsehi vb12320:13
vb123you either don't have error reporting set or it is not taking effect on the plugins code.20:13
vb123can you fix mantisbt code to make sure we have the strict error reporting by default and that helps surface the errors I reported.20:13
nuclear_eclipsethere are pieces of plugin code that was not originally written by me, so likely cause is that the other devs didn't change their error reporting settings20:13
vb123that makes a sense then.20:14
paulr_it's up to dev's to set error reporting imo20:14
vb123however, I can tell you the experience is going to be bad for users who have error reporting on.  All plugins have notices.20:14
nuclear_eclipsebug 11090 was just a simple problem of "not enough testing" :P20:14
paulr_in a production site20:14
paulr_shouldn't really have error reporting on20:14
vb123I'm OK with disabling it on production, but we should have them on by default for dev.20:15
vb123In the past we have suggested a developer mode that enables error reporting by default.20:15
paulr_dev's should really be able to turn on php error reporting20:15
vb123For example, auto set to developer mode if URL contains localhost or 127.0.0.120:15
paulr_it's not really *that* hard to set up php etc20:16
vb123We managed to get our core team into this habbit, but it would be easier if the plugin developers get this by default.20:16
paulr_(you need to set up php to report errors anyway20:16
nuclear_eclipsevb123: that wouldn't always work -- I have to list my hostname rather than localhost20:16
vb123nuclear_eclipse: I agree it is not perfect.  However, it is better than nothing.20:16
vb123I personally think we should have ON by default even in production.20:17
paulr_erm, no20:17
paulr_do you run your production asp.net sites in debug/trace mode? :)20:17
vb123no I don't, by we have detailed error reporting that we can set as off by default.20:17
paulr_the thing is20:17
paulr_if you install php20:17
vb123however, I would still get the exception / error on production.20:17
paulr_you have the option at that point to configure php.ini for debug type stuff20:18
paulr_you have option in config20:18
paulr_I think if someone is going to write a plugin20:18
paulr_we should be able to consider them able to install php20:19
paulr_with some sensible settings20:19
paulr_if they can't20:19
paulr_there's a good chance the plugin will be crap and full of issues20:19
vb123ok, we have a lot of crap then on git.mantisforge.org20:20
paulr_i'm hesitant to add logic to dynamically try and detect whether ones in debug mode20:21
paulr_as tbh20:21
paulr_it's something someone dev'ingphp should really be able to set20:21
vb123at least we should have one config option that tunes MantisBT to dev vs production environment.20:22
paulr_personally, I often find when dev'ing I end up needing to disable our error handler completely20:23
paulr_as it gets in the way20:23
vb123in the way of what?  doesn't it tell you about errors that might be hard to find otherwise?20:24
paulr_no20:24
paulr_as I turn our handler off20:24
paulr_and just use xdebug20:24
paulr_on it's own20:24
paulr_in some cases, i've had our error handler make things more difficult20:25
paulr_the only thing our error handler does20:25
paulr_is generate a nice pretty webpage when an error occurs (or try to)20:25
paulr_I dont really need/want that20:25
paulr_I just want the error details20:25
paulr_plain text suffices20:25
vb123ok, that's fine.  I just want the average php developer to find out about their errors.20:26
vb123I expect a lot of average developers to develop plugins that will affect the quality of MantisBT.20:26
vb123so at least, I would like to avoid breaking MantisBT.  I'm ok with their plugin being broken.20:27
paulr_I guess the question is whether one considers a warning to a be a break20:27
vb123even thought I would hope it won't be broken in a way that puts security holes.20:27
vb123in my environment it is.20:27
paulr_I'm just thinking20:27
paulr_I tend to run php-next-version20:27
paulr_tends to generate new warnings ;/20:28
paulr_it probably really requires guidance on what we have available atm20:28
paulr_if anything20:28
paulr_we need to drop some config variables20:28
paulr_where we allow micro-management of warnings/debug etc20:29
paulr_and just ahve a 'debug mode?' yes/no20:29
vb123yes, I think we should have a debug mode.20:29
vb123we can then have the error reporting on set when debug mode = true.20:29
vb123only set20:29
vb123with all settings as 'halt'.20:30
paulr_the problem really comes when some lib we use generates a warning20:30
paulr_tbh20:30
paulr_most of mantis code doesn't generate warnings20:30
paulr_(at least not for very long)20:31
vb123agreed.  early versions of MantisBT used to generate a lot of warnings until we started using the strict error reporting.20:32
vb123the tricky part is that when we use non-core MantisBT core (via libraries or plugins) in our environment, we will probably get some warnings.20:32
paulr_nod20:32
paulr_and the question is whether we start fixing those20:33
* giallu is around20:33
paulr_(for most part, php warnings are fairly obvious fixeS)20:33
vb123do we log the errors at the moment?  similar to logging emails, ldap, etc?20:33
paulr_not sure20:33
vb123the fixes are obvious, but they can cause the wrong behavior until they are fixed.  Hence, it is important to see them.20:33
vb123Maybe we should make the error handler always log the errors, which can be viewed using the EventLog plugin or by directing to a file.20:34
paulr_seems a bit pointless or well20:34
paulr_tbh20:34
paulr_depends who your thinking of20:35
paulr_i'd kinda expect core devs to have a clue20:35
paulr_end users dont really need to see errors + shouldn't get20:35
paulr_so the question is, are we saying plugin authors dont have a clue?20:35
vb123Eventlog would only be accessible to developers / admins.20:35
vb123we can ask them to look at it as part of support.20:35
paulr_it's just fairly rare our code actually generates warnings20:36
paulr_we tend to throw enough at it ;)20:36
vb123plugin developers have a clue, they develop a plugin, it works, they publish it.   They don't have as much experience on getting this to work robustly on all environments, without warnings, etc.20:36
paulr_nof20:36
paulr_nod20:36
paulr_what i need to do however at some point soon20:37
vb123note that our core code gets tested a lot compared to plugins.  At least, I'm referring to testing in dev environment.20:37
vb123that is why I decided to download all plugins and give them a try.20:37
paulr_is try to merge th current ldap api with my work version ;/20:37
paulr_so I can upgrade mantis at work20:37
vb123yep, I've done a lot of fixes in LDAP.20:37
vb123The main thing that we are missing now, is the ability to connect to multiple OUs or LDAP servers.20:37
paulr_i'm not sure i'm happy with some of them20:37
* paulr_ has support for multiple ou's20:38
paulr_I think the new code might generate more queries20:38
vb123You should port this into core then.20:38
vb123which part are you referring to?20:38
vb123that will generate more queries.20:38
paulr_I need to checkb20:38
paulr_but when I read it in july, I noted it down in notebook as something to check20:39
vb123ok.20:39
vb123I think the main changes were:20:39
vb1231. Added simulation mode which allowed me to find and fix issues with MantisBT when using LDAP.  Doesn't test integration with LDAP iteself.20:40
paulr_incidently - the thing I dont like is having some simulation thing in the main ldap api file20:40
paulr_we should have a copy of ldap api for that20:40
vb1232. Update native fields on login form LDAP to remove LDAP knowledge after knowledge.20:40
vb123native fields like email and realname.20:40
vb1233. auto-creation of MantisBT on first login of LDAP users.20:41
paulr_in fact, now i remember :)20:44
vb123?20:45
paulr_ldap_escape_string I believe is incomplete20:45
paulr_storing an md5 hash of an ldap password in db is a security risk20:46
paulr_the point of using ldap would be so you dont have passwords stored elsewhere in less secure formats20:46
paulr_I think where we changed the way we abstract the api calls they could lead to more calls, or at least if we collapsed them back down, I reckon we could reduce number of ldap calls and add functionality20:47
vb123We can have the LDAP storage of password as optional.20:47
paulr_are people requesting it?20:47
paulr_it seems kinda silly to add20:47
paulr_as what happens atm if someone uses SHA1() or whatever for auth and ldap20:48
vb123The question is whether we support hybrid of LDAP / normal or not.  And whether we want to support switching from LDAP to completely native.20:49
vb123I think we need to have a per user auth mode and a global auth mode20:49
vb123On user login, we convert the user to the global mode.20:49
vb123we could also have a couple of global auth modes.  For example, LDAP + MD5.20:49
vb123LDAP users would continue to use LDAP, otherwise, they will be converted to MD5 (e.g. from plain)20:49
paulr_but that's something to do when doing auth plugin's imo20:50
paulr_not now20:50
vb123Correct :) --- is this happening anytime soon?20:50
paulr_i've not touched much for about 2-3 months now, although starting to find more time20:51
vb123great.20:51
paulr_my main issue atm is i want to try and make db stuff work realiably20:51
paulr_been looking at moodle's approach20:51
vb123I'm assuming you are planning this for 1.3.x20:51
paulr_as dhx/john know20:51
paulr_moodle moved from adodb to their own abstraction gpl laye20:51
paulr_well20:51
paulr_we've branched20:51
paulr_trunk and 1.220:51
paulr_so yes20:52
paulr_it's something for trunk20:52
vb123agreed.  I just want to make sure we don't port to 1.2.x20:52
paulr_we've already ported too much imo20:52
vb123also to avoid very big changes until 1.2.0 gold is out.  To keep the merging simple.20:52
vb123the best way to avoid porting too much is to get 1.2.0 released.20:53
paulr_we've added new features into 1.2 since rc220:53
paulr_which is stupid20:53
vb123whick ones r y refering to?20:54
paulr_or even rc120:54
paulr_lets see20:54
paulr_2009-10-06John Reese20:54
paulr_to be fair20:55
paulr_probably more since rc1 then rc220:55
vb123correct, that is my feeling too.20:55
vb123we need help in closing 1.2.0 if you have cycles.20:56
vb123including untargetting issues from 1.2.x20:56
paulr_since the bump to 1.3.0dev on trunk (11th July 2009)20:56
paulr_i've only got around to reviewing commits20:57
paulr_i've got a list of 19 things I want to check based on those commits20:57
paulr_:(20:57
vb123i actually think we should have 1.2.0 on the roadmap and 1.2.x.20:57
vb1231.2.0 are the musts before releasing 1.2.020:57
vb1231.2.x is for dot builds after then.20:57
paulr_for example20:58
paulr_http://git.mantisbt.org/?p=mantisbt.git;a=commitdiff;h=61804a9da622dd0519fea853924bdab5bddbd93320:58
paulr_changing the logic of ini_set20:58
paulr_when reading that I thought at first glance that it would break compression on iis20:59
paulr_I think I then concluded it doesn't, but whilst concluding that that using the 'recommended' settings for compression handlers20:59
paulr_that it breaks that error handler20:59
paulr_and whilst trying to work out if that is actually the case, needing to diagnose ob_* calls21:00
paulr_which then lead to concluding that the utf8 lib calls ob_* every time it's called (aka a few thousand times)21:00
paulr_so I first need to replace some of the utf8 library functions with my own version so I can work out why the error handler broke21:01
paulr_which is a nice fun exercise21:01
paulr_which may as well lead to why the utf8 library varies output of functions to php6/perl utf8 functions21:02
paulr_maybe21:51
paulr_we should run an ldap.mantisbt.org service21:51

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